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Consensual Non-Monogamy
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Lemmings and I have many fantasies and usually we share them. However, there are two fantasies which I found very hard for her to indulge. First was pegging. When I first brought it up while we were dating she honestly thought I was kidding. Even now she enjoys the act only once it starts but the amount of convincing and waiting I have to do each time is exhausting. Second is the MMF threesome and cuckolding specifically.
When I first brought up the MMF threesome with Lemmings years ago she thought I missed sleeping around with other men (I am openly bisexual but haven't slept with a man since I started dating Lemmings; hence my need for pegging). But she was taken by complete surprise when I said I actually wanted her to sleep with other men at will, not involve me, and even tell me about it. I never introspected why or what I specifically liked about it until today. For her part, she says she hated bringing a "second penis" in our relationship. Instead she wants us to try the MFF threesome instead (but in her presence).
Em's recent posts about Kev's and her shared boyfriend led us to discuss this at length over dinner (@evolvingyourman_ivcr4j you are a dinner topic!). Lemmings was the one who opened the topic as I had been making her read Em's posts. She said that before we even consider this particular fetish, we both needed to be sure why it was fetish for me.
She started by asking me what I found a turn on with her sleeping around. I thought about it and my honest answer was that I didn't fully know. But a bit of thought made me realise that it was more about me than about her. It was just my kink to be humiliated this way and to be denied sex because she had already had it with someone else. I have no idea why that makes it so arousing for me but it is what it is.
For my part I asked her why she would refuse such a generous offer. I asked her if she was worried it would screw up our relationship and she said it was not possible. And I agree. I think over the years we have invested so much in our relationship that it would make it very hard for us to break up over actions taken after deliberation. And we were deliberating this one, weren't we? I think eventually I homed in on the right answer. Lemmings just does not trust strangers. She wants it done with a friend and she only knows a few men that closely but has never thought of them this way.
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I think bringing friends into a shared relationship can be tricky. While it may not break us up, it is quite likely to affect our friendship with the person whom we bring into our bedroom. Lemmings thinks the safest bet is a particular friend of hers whom we both know is sexually very open minded. While it does not fulfill my fantasy it certainly spices our relationship. She proposed inviting her this Friday for a sleepover (we are allowed to invite people over now).
But I have asked for more time. I think both of us need to think this one through and part of the reason I am writing this all down is to clear my own mind up (following Em's post somewhere where she said writing helped her think clearly).
I definitely want to thank Em and Kev for sharing their story about Andrew. Inadvertently, it made us talk about our fetishes and think deeply about it all. Its the most progress we have made on this topic in all these years.
Posted : 11/08/2020 2:39 pm
Although we are not great practitioners of cuckolding (we have, however, tried it a few times to satisfy a fantasy of my husband), I understand your wife's reaction.
I remember that when my better half told me about this fantasy I was pretty scared.
Of course, having another man in our bed isn't really scary in itself, but it's the long-term psychological side of it that I feared the most.
The experience was very exciting for both me and my husband, however, it is a practice that we only repeat on very rare occasions (usually on my initiative when I want to make him really crazy) because if chastity and the games involved already require a very good communication within the couple, cuckolding implies a higher level of communication so that no member of the couple is harmed or frustrated by the experience.
From my point of view, we must not lose sight of the fact that what is said or done during cuckolding sessions remains in the realm of the game and that an important debriefing is necessary in the days following the session because in the heat of the moment we can be led to say things that we think are exciting for our partner but that can be misinterpreted.
In short, as always and as in any game including two (or more) adults and a bed (or a table, or a car...) communication remains the basis of everything.
Posted : 11/08/2020 11:45 pm
It was just my kink to be humiliated this way and to be denied sex because she had already had it with someone else. I have no idea why that makes it so arousing for me but it is what it is.
I also find it really difficult to articulate why I am turned on by the thought of my wife with another guy. We have never gone through with it and I am not really sure I could handle the emotions. What if she cared for him in more than a sexual way? Sex is so intimate.
I am quite certain that my turn-on is not about my humiliation. For me, it’s about her pleasure and confidence. Confidence is really arousing to me. When I imagine my wife being certain that she wants another guy’s cock, that she seduces him and gets off with him, it really triggers my submissive side. It’s like the extreme of taking what she wants. I imagine the other guy being out of control with lust for her.
The other part is about that idea of compersion (thanks, Emma). I get pleasure from witnessing my wife’s pleasure. I recently told her that if I had to choose between giving and getting oral, with no chance of the opposite choice for the rest of my life, I would not hesitate to choose giving oral. I think the same thing is happening with the cuckold fantasy. I would rather see my wife get an amazing fuck than for me to have exclusive access for my own pleasure. But I would definitely need a cuddle with her right after.
Posted : 12/08/2020 7:55 pm
I agree with finding the confidence for my wife to take another partner as a major turn on. I see it as more as a sign of confidence in not only herself as a woman, but also in my relationship and our ability to properly communicate.
You say that you have hard time explaining it, but think you have done an excellent job. I find that when it comes to time explain those feelings to my wife the words can falter at times. And it is part of why I requested that she read this blog and some of the forums posts. There is a plethora of good information about being in a healthy, exploratory relationship and also because I feel able to put some of my thoughts in word better. She can read my thoughts here, find references if she needs to research. Even if she doesn't I have found it still helps me outline what I want to talk about
Posted : 13/08/2020 4:32 am
@vikter I think cuckolding may be rooted in insecurities. I wrote a blog about the sexualization of insecurities and I wonder if the male cuckolding fantasy is rooted in fear of losing her. He fears that she will run off with another guy so the human mind (being the true asshole that it is) sexualizes that fear as a coping mechanism.
@evolvingyourman_ivcr4j
I did give that article a read sometime back, I should give it another read though.
The original fantasy for me was definitely rooted in my fear of losing my wife (then still gf). I was very insecure in the fact that she even wanted to be with me. Over the years she has calmed my mind, in many ways she is the one to keep me safe. (Think Blackwidow and the Hulk, when I get lost a touch and a word calls me back in a heartbeat) Because of how she has literally changed my mind the feelings of insecurity have been washed away leaving only desire to see her happy and confident. It also washed out most of the more porn fantasy elements of it, wanting something more real and developmental. To me it would be the ultimate expression of her confidence in herself and in our relationship to be able to take a lover, either with or without me. And while I cannot predict the outcome of what would happen, I trust her to communicate that.
I think it also has something to do with her understanding of her own sexuality. For me, learning to separate love and sex as I came to terms with my own sexuality and societys definition of sexuality has made all the difference. It isn't an easy thing but it is much more fulfilling to be able to satisfy those two needs independent of each other. This is absolutely something that I am still struggling with but it gets easier and I understand so much more about myself with each experience.
Posted : 15/08/2020 1:08 pm
Hi @evolvingyourman_ivcr4j
When I read your answer, I wondered about the extent of the social weight in this difficulty to differentiate the love of sexuality for women.
It also took me a long time to get to the point of "sex for sex" (something I'm taking on more and more).
But thinking back, it occurred to me that since I was a teenager I've been hearing that women don't have a sexual need to satisfy, they have sex for love.
I mean that society is understanding (for example) towards male masturbation where female masturbation remains a taboo.
Don't you think there's a cause and effect link on the difficulty for women to separate the sexual act from love? Haven't we simply heard too much about sex for a woman being an act of love? That a man who multiplies his conquests is a Don Juan where a woman who does the same is a slut?
Posted : 17/08/2020 4:15 am
The first few times I had sex, I didn't have an orgasm and a couple of the partners seemed very unconcerned about that. Yes, I was young and so were the partners. From the start, Kevin was as interested in me receiving that precious orgasm as he was. Now the tables are turned and I receive many more orgasms than he does and we have come to terms with that decisions as a couple. Such a strange world that we live in. Let's just all love each other and treat each other how we want to be treated.
Posted : 17/08/2020 8:39 am
@evolvingyourman_ivcr4j
I think that unfortunately, the lack of orgasm (or consideration for female orgasm) is the lot of every young woman.
I've also had my share of men who have had little concern for my pleasure. From my point of view this is unfortunately partly linked to the image of sex reflected in pornography where the pleasure of the man is much more emphasized than that of the woman.
Finally, all this digression to say that you are right, the most important thing is to be treated with equal respect, usually the rest follows naturally.
It's easier to deal with a man who wants to give us pleasure but can't do it than with a man who only cares about his own.
Posted : 17/08/2020 9:38 am
@evolvingyourman_ivcr4j
There was another element that I was led to believe and that was women only have sex within a relationship where the was an emotional attachment for the woman to the man. I was told that sex without this would be meaningless and unfulfilling.
Now of course I think that this view was only promulgated to discourage 'promiscuity' as that was unbecoming for a young lady! This was a hang over from when we didn't have effective contraception and single mothers were ostracised as 'loose' women.
I've been lucky in that my husband has always taken great pleasure from ensuring that I am sated before he ever took his release. Now of course he doesn't have the choice - lol. But before that he started to suffer from ED, and so there was a natural swing away from the focus on his needs anyway.
My session with the Domme helped me considerably with learning to separate love and sex too. It released me from those confines and allowed me to explore with others without the guilt.
Posted : 17/08/2020 11:18 am
The other part is about that idea of compersion (thanks, Emma). I get pleasure from witnessing my wife’s pleasure.
Thank you so much for your comment midlife_marty. I've been trying to figure out how to put into words the attraction in i feel towards the idea of my wife getting sexual pleasure from another person, and in this case another man. I have zero desire to be "cuckolded" in the common stereotypical sense. I have no desire to be present for the purposes of humiliation. I, like you, get immense sexual pleasure from seeing my wife have sexual pleasure. Also like, I'm not sure i could handle the emotions of her potentially falling for this lover for precisely the same reason. Sex IS so intimate. I think for that reason that if it were to ever happen, for me at least it would have to be in the context of the other person being considered a human sex toy, there to give a unique sexual to my wife. Wishful thinking perhaps, but given that I know my desire for this is to bear witness to my Wife experiencing great sex, and not to be humiliated or considered inferior to the third person providing the pleasure, I'm certain that this comment of yours applies to me as well.
I would rather see my wife get an amazing fuck than for me to have exclusive access for my own pleasure. But I would definitely need a cuddle with her right after.
Posted : 25/08/2020 7:32 am
My session with the Domme helped me considerably with learning to separate love and sex too. It released me from those confines and allowed me to explore with others without the guilt.
May I ask .... what session with the Domme?
Posted : 25/08/2020 8:23 am
Hi
I gave a bit more detail about my visit with a pro domme here https://www.evolvingyourman.com/community/introductions/a-little-introduction/paged/2/#post-946
it's on page 2.
Happy to answer any other questions you may have.
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